For years I was of the opinion that the D&D
Rules Encyclopedia was the best everything-you-need-in-one-book version of the game ever produced by TSR. It has lots and lots of stuff: Classes beyond the BX 4+3 in both core and prestige varieties, rules for play up to 36th level, craploads of monsters, an optional skill system, weapon mastery rules, the War Engine mass combat system, maps of the Known World of Mystara, rules for becoming Immortal, etc, etc, forever and ever Ah-men.
But at some point I turned a corner on wanting all that stuff spelled out for me. Nowadays I think Dr. Holmes's rulebook is the shiniest one-book approach to D&D that TSR put out. Why? Because it is
woefully incomplete. There's just enough D&D there to play some D&D and hardly anything more. The rest of it is on the DM. How do the gods work? What does the world look like? How do I run a whole war? I'm not sure I want my D&D corebook answering those questions for me anymore. The
Rules Cyclopedia is still a great book. I'd call it a star in the crown of TSR. But I'm pretty sure it's way more D&D than I'll ever need.
But at some point I turned a corner on wanting all that stuff spelled out for me. Nowadays I think Dr. Holmes's rulebook is the shiniest one-book approach to D&D that TSR put out. Why? Because it is woefully incomplete. There's just enough D&D there to play some D&D and hardly anything more. The rest of it is on the DM. How do the gods work? What does the world look like? How do I run a whole war? I'm not sure I want my D&D corebook answering those questions for me anymore. The Rules Cyclopedia is still a great book. I'd call it a star in the crown of TSR. But I'm pretty sure it's way more D&D than I'll ever need.
I can see that. I guess I prefer the "complete" types of games because I can pick and choose the pieces I need. The "incomplete" ones are sufficient if they happen to hits the situations I need covered and insufficient if they don't. I'd rather have a big selection to choose from.
ReplyDeleteNot that Holmes isn't cool, but I'd be more likely to play Cyclopedia D&D just because if I need something and I don't have the time or inclination to make it up, I don't have to.
I agree, although my current cup-o-tea is the LBBs. It's a ton of fun using them as the framework and adding my own stuff - and my players seem to be fond of this approach as well. The only issue is that I find my uncreative self often gravitating towards looking to other versions/clones/etc. to fill in the gaps rather than inventing cool stuff on my own.
ReplyDeleteI'm fine with some level of DIY encouragement, but I think that you need a bit more than Holmes. IIRC (and if I don't, my apologies), but Holmes only takes characters from levels 1-3. I think that a bit more progression is called for - 1-6, perhaps.
ReplyDeleteSure, sure. I'm just saying you can make your own charts for levels 4+.
DeleteInterestingly, early 90's TSR seemed to think Levels 1-3 was a bit too low as well... This led to:
DeleteThe New, Easy To Master Dungeons & Dragons Game(1991-94) edited by Troy Denning and Timothy B. Brown(colloquially referred to as the Black Box) and this slightly tweaked version of the Mentzer D&D rules went up to level *5*!(Now yer Wizard can Fireball/Lightning Bolt before the cutoff. Yay! :-) ) It was in widespread distribution in Hobby Shops, Toy Stores, Wal-mart, and other assorted retail outlets that carried games. I guess the inclusion of poster mats and plastic figures made it look less RPGish or something and it was given a place in the Toy/Games section of the mainstream stores. It was supposed to tie into the D&D Rules Encyclopedia and the World of Mystara products(before that setting was dumped unceremoniously into 2nd Edition AD&D). In '94 this set was lightly edited by Doug Stewart(the mechanics were largely the same as the Black Box, with the entry level adventure transferred off the unwieldy quick learning loose-leaf binder and incorporated directly into the Rule Book), changed box sizes from landscape to portrait and got a new(and brown!) cover and was renamed the Classic Dungeons & Dragons Game.(Of course, now it was a standalone product, as the Cyclopedia and other Mystara related supplements items were defunct.) A few printings later 'Classic' went back to the Black Box cover(though still in the smaller standard RPG box). It stuck around until 1999 whereupon it was discontinued and replaced with the D&D Adventure Game. Sadly, said 'D&D' Adventure Game was actually a Fast-Play version of *AD&D 2nd Edition* which allowed only pre-generated PCs and supplied no rules for level advancement. And so vanished Basic D&D... :-(
I guess you could say that 1977-1999 was a good run, though. Personally, I can't help wishing Basic would return.(Of course, the various Basics could be reprinted with Wizbro's recent discovery of their back catalog, and there's always the last ditch PDF option.) Some might even say that it *has* rose from the dead, albeit in Pathfinder format. What with their Beginner Box, and all.
That is almost exactly the path that my thinking on D&D has taken. It wasn't even a year ago that I even posted to James Mal's blog that the Cyclopedia was the perfect D&D, but somewhere in the intervening period I've changed my mind to prefer the good Doctor's edition.
ReplyDeleteNowadays I think Dr. Holmes's rulebook is the shiniest one-book approach to D&D that TSR put out. Why? Because it is woefully incomplete. There's just enough D&D there to play some D&D and hardly anything more. The rest of it is on the DM.
ReplyDeleteThis is one of the reasons that there really isn't a retro-clone of Holmes out there. In fact, I don't know if one is possible because any attempt is inevitably going to be a unique DYI version of D&D (trust me, I've tried). However, as you have so aptly stated, this is one of the reasons I am so attracted to Holmes and continue to read it and fiddle with it.
I'm not sure if this would count for you (as it expands the level progression), but there is Holmes77:
Deletehttp://www.lulu.com/shop/rc-pinnell/holmes77/ebook/product-17405170.html
Myself, I gravitate now towards Moldvay B/X, but for similar reasons.
Pickin up Holmes was really the turning point for me in how I approached gaming. Realizing that the rules set was not only completely playable, but so easily hacked and mutated clicked with me.
ReplyDeletefaoladh or Jeff
ReplyDeleteI could probably relieve you of your Rules Encyclopedia copies if you like. :)
I'm glad to read that you're getting some religion, Jeff. ;)
ReplyDeleteWhile Holmes is awesome for all the reasons you mention, my current favorite is the first volume ONLY of 1974 D&D (i. e., the Men & Magic book). I don't need the stuff from the other two books. I like to make my own monsters, magic items, encounter tables, etc. That's only 34 HALF-SIZED PAGES in my D&D rulebook. :D
I like to make it all up. The crazier, the better. Hell, I don't even pay any attention to half of the content of even Men & Magic. I basically use the rules for making human fighters, the to hit tables, the saving throw tables, the reaction table, and the rules for adjustments for high or low ability scores.
Spell-casters? Magic spells? Bah. I make my own stuff up.
I have to say, I have really gained a huge appreciation for the Holmes edition over the last year. For me, B/X is still my favorite version of D&D, but for my own "pet project" version of D&D I find myself using Holmes as my main reference source (especially for monsters).
ReplyDeleteGreat topic; I've had similar thoughts. Last year on the Acaeum someone was wondering why anyone likes Holmes since it is incomplete, to which I replied that "the lack of an official version for the higher levels of Holmes is an open invitation to everyone who likes Holmes to create their own expansion".
ReplyDeleteA certain tension will always exist in D&D between paring back to a simple core and adding in lots of detail, from either yourself or others (or most likely a mix of both).
Yep. Great version of D&D.
ReplyDeleteHi Jeff--big fan, first time writing. I think that Holmes does kinda defy the whole retro-clone approach and confirm it at the same time. Not only is there only enough there to play a little D&D, so much of that ruleset is the way Holmes phrases this or that-- just like what people often ascribe to High Gygaxian in the AD&D hardbacks. There is something inimitable there, that cannot be 'restated' properly, but that's part of the weird perfection of those 48 pages. And it feels wide open and unique at the same time... a real achievement.
ReplyDeleteIt is interesting to note how many Holmes expansions are out there. I can think of six, right off the bat, but I'm pretty sure I've got at least seven or eight on my hard drive, right now.
ReplyDeleteI have no time to make it all up. I think I prefer the Cyclopedia. I can always ignore the stuff I don't need, but when I don't have the time, it's there.
ReplyDeleteI still think the cyclopedia strikes a perfect balance between enough and too much, but I'm a maniacal completist
ReplyDeleteRight there with you Jeff... My friends all thought I'd gotten ripped off when I showed up with the "basic" D&D box set (as opposed to the White Box. Still, I was the only one in our group with a real book and not scribbles and poor photocopies (expensive photocopies back in that day) for a rule set. My Holmes Box came with dice, a module and the left was left up to me.
ReplyDeleteI believe the simplistic and common sense way Holmes approaches the game has influenced my gaming tastes for over 30+ years. In fact, I create and run ONLY low-level adventures campaigns with 3rd Level being the highest a character may achieve. Life is short, harsh, and unforgiving. Characters should never be on an equal footing with mythical monsters (dragons, purple worms, etc.). Questing for legendary artifacts to use in defeating these beasts is what drives the game (and the rewards for defeating the odds and killing something absolutely out of league and above a characters ability).
About the only changes I've made over the years are: Constitution plus class/race die roll for Hit Points (does not change with level advancement), an occasional skill roll against attributes (varying the number of d6's by difficulty), a varied Ascending Armour Class, Soak Damage for Armour, Saves VS are used very rarely, and daggers do NOT get two attacks during combat.
One other change I have used at times is Dexterity Armour Ratings. This has allowed us to play Planetary Sword and Sorcery Campaigns. Dexterity is tied directly in with Armour Class. I use a hacked Ascending Armour so a character with 15 Dexterity also has a Armour Class of 15. Armour slows one down and lowers effective Dexterity, but it also has more protection (thus the soaking of hit points by armour). A character can finally fight with a sword, loin-clothe of ring-mail, and hair flowing down to his arse: Harder to hit, but takes quite a bit of damage if not protected. Still, at low-level play either side must be fairly sure of success before rushing into confrontations.
peace
That sounds like a very cool ruleset.
DeleteONLY Low-level campaigns with 3rd being the highest? And your crew's been doing this, for like, *years* and stuff? Man, *I* thought *I* could talk my players into some hardcore shizz. You just win, sir.
DeleteDitto on the the coolness of the rules set. Intriguing take on modifying AC/DEX for Planetary S&S, in particular. Love that kinda playing around with the game's underlying mechanics...
Jeff: "like".
ReplyDeleteGeoffrey: IMO the approach you suggest also needs the two or three pages of Underworld and Wilderness Adventures dealing with surprise and a couple of other things, but other than that you're good to go.
- Calithena
My first Holmes boxed set didn't come with dice, but with chits that you had to cut out yourself. There was an order form in the box, so you could send away for dice. I loved the chits, and used them until I lost them. Now, I'm thinking of making my own DYI chits, just because...
ReplyDelete;)
I've noticed that a lot of us are on a similar path; (My path: Holmes > B/X > AD&D1e > AD&D2e > RC/BECMI > AD&D1e > 0e > Holmes.) Several years ago I bought a used copy of the RC, and I used these rules for my PBEM until the cover fell off and the pages fell out! I loved it, but I, along with a lot of others, have gravitated back in time to Holmes, and I, like many others, have been working on a "Holmes Expansion" that is directly compatible with one of my favorite LBB supplements: Greyhawk.
Prison Edition FTW! The Blue Book I purchased 3 years back turned out to be one of these.(3rd Edition, 2nd Printing, to be exact.) Sadly, it was without the chits and Dice Set Coupon... But, hey, it was inexpensive *and* came with the Red Box(sans crappy Lo Impact Dice) *and* Monster and Treasure Assortment as extras, so I can't complain! :-)
ReplyDeleteIncidentally, for those who want a printable set of chits, look here, courtesy of one isomage.
Another Blue Book Expansion? One based on Greyhawk? Cool!
Fun Fact: Holmes itself incorporates quite a few additions from that Supplement. Can anyone imagine D&D *without* Magic Missile? Conversely, *I* could certainly envision the game without those pesky Thieves, though.(As any of my players could attest.) ;-)
Oops. This was *supposed* to be a direct reply to Bobjester, not the first of a doublepost!
DeleteOh, and thanx, Jeff, for fishing my comments out of limbo.
I'll add my own praise to the glowing endorsements of Holmes mentioned here, and elsewhere on the Web(by me, among others), by saying it's the best version of D&D *ever*, imo. One must note that the vaunted Moldvay/Cook/Marsh B/X and beloved Mentzer Red Box are its descendants, and owe much of their success to Holmes' vision. It's great to see that the Blue Book is garnering more interest in recent years, and will continue to influence RPGs for untold years to come!
ReplyDeleteThe Blue Book is a quick read, that's simple to understand, easy to run, and fast in play, shot through with a authorial voice that's ebullient and well-versed in the subject matter, and never comes across as being pedantic and/or fixated on word rate. Holmes is the perfect rules set for an RPG novice to learn the basics from, *and* it's ideal for a stripped-down, bare-bones FRPG for those who enjoy gritty and perilous play. Not to mention, the mechanics are perfectly suited to be developed into a game that ranges across various power levels. Even for those who have no use for its specific interpretation of the FRPG, its insights or its charm, the Blue Book stands as a priceless historical artifact, a window into how the game was played Back Then.
I'm glad I was able to grab a copy a few years back. It's proven to be a repeated source of inspiration, and great fun to read and utilize. Holmes is up there in my personal pantheon of all-time great RPG rules alongside Tunnels & Trolls 5th Edition, Call of Cthulu, Runequest 2nd Edition, the AD&D DMG, and AD&D 2nd Edition's Ravenloft: Realm of Terror Box Set.
Any fans of the Blue Book should definitely check out Zenopus Archives' site, btw.
Thanks for the plug, velaran. Reminds me I need to put some more work into the site rather than just blogging!
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